The Cliff Richard Fan Club

The mild man of pop
By: Angela Wellington
When: 21 December 2002, The West Magazine

Clean-shaven, clean-cut, a Christian... has there ever been a more unlikely pop success than Cliff Richard? Music's Mr Nice Guy explains what makes him carry on after more than 40 years in showbiz.

IT'S 1966. There's war in Vietnam. Suharta seizes power in Indanesia. Robert Menzies retires after 16 years as Australia's prime minister. Decimal currency hijacks uur purses. The mini-skirt invades our wardrobes. John Lennon meets Yoko Ono, 50-year-old Frank Sinatra marries 21-year-old Mia Farrow, The Beach Boys are picking up Good Vibrations and, as if the world isn't quite turbulent enough, Cliff Richard talks abaut quitting the business of being a pop star and becoming a teacher of divinity.

"I'm not bored with show business, but there are times when I feel I am wasting my life," frets the 25-year-old British rock 'n' roll idol. Born Harry Webb, Richard had set out on the path to renown eight years before with Move It, and then accelerated into stardom with Living Doll. Now he is rethinking priorities: "I don't want to sound like a martyr, but for me there are more important things in life than being a singer. I certainly don't want to be in show business a11 my life."

That was 1966. Since then he's enjoyed a swag of hits, picked up an OBE, been knighted for his charity work and - far from pursuing a self-imposed exile - written himself into pop history.

Yellowed clippings in The West Australian's biographical file trace more than four decades of Cliff's doings and sayings, comings and goings. He has been variously "the Pretty Boy with the silken style" (1963), "the perfect advertisement for Christianity" (1973), "one of the original Mr Nice Guys" (1979), "British pop music's eternal fountain of youth" (1983), "the squeaky-clean pillar of virtue" (1990) and, of course, "the Peter Pan of pop". The consistency of his good-guy image is as striking as his endurance. Now, at 62, he is hitting the international tour trail again.

Speaking from Windsor where he was in rehearsals recently - "we're almost in view of the castle" - Richard graciously remembered that pivotal period in the 60s. It was a time when his spiritual awakening seemed at odds with his career choice.

"All the friends who helped me achieve that moment in my life were all teachers or they worked for charities and things. And I thought, oh they're doing really valuable jobs, they're doing something that's actually assisting other people in their lives. I thought, look, I can't be a pop singer, it's too easy, I should get out."

But before his plans could be put into action his recording manager suggested he make a gospel album, a television company proposed he be part of six religious programs and he was approached by the Billy Graham group, who were looking for a Christian actor to be in a movie. Richard realised that while he'd been thinking he was valueless within show business, others were saying they wanted him because he was a Christian in show business. He rethought his plans, and changed his mind - the right decision, he felt, even if mildly embarrassing. "The press had a little bit of a field day with it."

Ever since, in an industry where being subversive does wonders for your artistic credibility, Richard has been something of an anomaly. To be famously nice is, well, nice - but it can open the door to mockery and even a particularly perverse form of disdain. The singer remembers reading in a review in the 1970s: "The Cliff Richard Show is so wholesome it makes me sick."

The comment just didn't make sense to a person who holds with the notion that wholesome lifestyles are about being healthy. You can't listen to people like that, Richard told himself. "So the nice boy bit didn't bother me any more... because the alternative is that I'm a bad boy, or neutral, which is even worse."

Nobody's perfect, so giving the impression you're nice - "which is all that one does" - means not airing your dirty laundry in public, he says. He would rather talk about triumphs than failures, and let people know it's possible for them to defeat their problem too. "Privately I talk about the things that worry me, or that I feel I do wrong and badly and fail in."

Professionally speaking, Richard has had more than the standard quota of triumphs, selling some 250 million records over more than four decades. The first of these successes - Move It - will always have a special place in his heart, he says. The 1958 release was, he believes, the first rock'n'roll record made outside America. A happy accident, he calls it - a record which could be played alongside Elvis Presley and Jerry Lee Lewis and fit in.

And for this aspiring pop star, Presley was the big inspiration. The prototype.

"From then onwards, we all copied him in some way and then the lucky ones of us found something that was our own. I found something that was me, but it's still based on what Elvis was. I always think if Elvis hadn't existed I wouldn't have happened as a pop star."

Richard recently worked out he'd composed about 50 of his own songs ("I didn't realise I'd written that many") but doesn't hesitate to put them in their not-so-glorious place. Most of his better-known songs were the creations of others. "I'm no fool, you know. I quite like writing but if I hear (something as good as) We Don't Talk Anymore, I dump my one. . . I'd rather have it."

When he first heard that song he recognised it as "almost certainly" a hit. He didn't know whether it would be number one - "no one knows that" - but there is a feeling that says a song will be in the top 10. The 1979 single sold nearly 3 million. It also fits Richard's idea of a great pop record - that anybody else could have successfully sung it.

"If some other pop singer had got hold of We Don't Talk Anymore, he or she would have had the same size hit with it."

It doesn't seem the sort of thing a singer should run around confessing. Does he really believe this? "Oh yeah, I'm sure of it. But I got it first."

Richard is not confused about his musical identity. He likes pop and has never veered far from it. That said, he points out there are a multitude of songs and styles that fit under that umbrella. While he makes the most of developments in technology, he isn't beholden to music trends and still uses old-fashioned instinct when it comes to choosing songs.

"But I always feel that my sound on stage will be contemporary. Even though we're singing some of these old 50s and 60s rock'n'roll, my band is a band of today and that's the way they play it now. It's pretty funky. I love it."

Richard enjoys being on the road and clearly hasn't lost the performer's desire for an audience. "There's something about going out on stage. When you get out there you know that everybody there is just there to see you and it's a fantastic feeling."

Even so, a long tour has its tests - worrying about getting i11 and being unable to sing, the usual show-biz pressures, being away from home and perpetually sleeping in strange beds. Not that the domestic arrangements are exactly punishing.

"Unlike the days when The Shadows and I first got started and we used to rush around the town trying to find a bed-and-breakfast place - trying to find one cheap... now we stay in all these wonderful first-class hotels. It's hardly a sacrifice."

Having first visited Australia in 1961 and loving it, the loyalty of Antipodean fans has helped maintain his affection for the place. If people stopped turning up for his concerts, he wouldn't bother touring: "I'd just come back and have a holiday."

In 2000 Richard took a year off. Retirement entered his mind a number of times but he rejected the idea, preferring to try to slow down. (He realises the statement sounds ridiculous just before he sets out on a six-month world tour.) "I mean if I get chucked out, that's different. I'll pretend I've retired."

While the real Cliff Richard continues to develop his career, a separate creative team in Britain is working on a musical simply called Cliff. Reportedly featuring a Shadows tribute group and three "Cliffs", it is expected to open next March. Richard is flattered and thrilled with the project - albeit in a tentative sort of way. Even though he has no part in the production, he knows that if it fails his name is all over it.

This name - or, more accurately the successes associated with it - have brought him some tangible blessings. He has three beautiful homes in England, Barbados and Portugal and doesn't bother to disguise his appreciation of these trappings.

"When people say money doesn't change them they probably mean that it maybe hasn't spoiled them, but it does change you - I have a lifestyle (where) I can actually get away from the crowds and I do that."

His private life is pretty ordinary, he says. "I lead a very quiet existence really." His close friends tend to be people who are not in show business and, like anyone else, he'll get a call to see if he wants to catch up for a movie and dinner on a Sunday night. Or he'll have a hit of tennis. Or he'll cultivate his own vineyard. OK, maybe his extracurricular pursuits are not all so very ordinary.

The first vintage of Vida Nova wine, produced using grapes from Richard's vineyard in the Algarve region of Portugal, was released this year. He had always wanted his small farm to be a working proposition but had been told by the farmer who ran it that he couldn't sell grapes. He was confident however, of selling figs - so figs it was. Three years later, when they were about to get their first fig crop, Richard met Australian winemaker David Baverstock. He was apparently keen to be the first man to make a good wine in the Algarve. Could it be done on Richard's property. Of course.

"So I uprooted all my fig trees and planted 16 acres of vines and he made the wine."

The entertainer is clearly tickled to hear critics talk of chocolate and blackcurrants, of tannins discreetly making their entrances and retreats. The goal: to live up to that debut review.

"It's very exciting because it's got nothing to do with rock'n'roll and it was so nice to be involved in something else." The decision to stick with show business has undoubtedly brought exceptional success for Richard. With the benefit of hindsight, however, is there anything he would do differently in his career?

In short, no. Ten years ago he wouldn't have said that. "I'd probably think of a million things."

Since then he's come to realise that he is who he is today because of what he's been and done yesterday. Today he really likes where he is and who he is - and if he went back with regrets and changed anything, he reasons, he may not be as happy with himself now.

"So I can honestly say no, I would live through it all again."

Cliff Richard plays at the Burswood Dome on January 31.

BBC BREAKFAST WITH FROST INTERVIEW: SIR CLIFF RICHARD APRIL 28th, 2002

DAVID FROST: By this weekend thousands of music fans should have found out if they've been lucky in the ticket ballot for the Golden Jubilee concerts at Buckingham Palace. Two million people have applied for either the classical concert or the pop concert and there are just 24,000 tickets available. The one man who already knows that he's certainly going to get in is Sir Cliff Richard. He's one of the many stars who'll be up there on stage. Now Cliff has had hits for more than 30 years, 40 years virtually yes now, more than 40 years and this month he releases his 129th single, it's called Let Me Be The One and it's made its way into the charts already. I spoke to him earlier and I began by asking him which of all those many songs, those 129 singles means the most to him?

CLIFF RICHARD: Well I suppose the one that I think means most to me is because I think I was lucky to get probably one of the best pop rock songs ever written and that was We Don't Talk Anymore. There's a certain sound about a pop rock record that it's hard to say why you like it instantly but everybody else did too, it sold so much around the world and so I would say that that was probably the best one I've done.

DAVID FROST: Does your style consciously change over the years, I mean music changes, do you change or do you try and remain the same?

CLIFF RICHARD: Essentially I suppose all of us remain basically the same, it's a matter of being able to juggle your way into what's happening new. The stuff that's new is based a lot on technology and if you allow technology into your recording studio, which is not a difficult thing to do, the guys that do all that and know what they're talking about, they punch up sounds on computers and sample sounds, all you have to do is say like it, don't like it, find me another one, and, and, what I've always done though and I think that's what's helped me over the years is that you try to, when a song comes along you think how best can I sing this. When I did Devil Woman for instance the obvious thing was to [sings] she's just a devil woman, sing it out loud, bang it away, heavy rock and roll but just mucking around I sort of sang it with a very husky [sings] I've had nothing but bad luck and Bruce Walsh who was producing went do that again, do that again and you find a sound for the song. I'm still limited to being Cliff Richard of course, you know so there's a limit as to what I can do and how much I can change it.

DAVID FROST: Do you see it as much of a buzz out of your 129th single as your first, I mean or going on stage in your forthcoming tour, will you feel as excited as in your first tour or is that unrealistic?

CLIFF RICHARD: To be honest I suppose it's unrealistic although having said that I, the first few days of, on a new tour are so exciting and nerve wracking, that's the thing that I'm amazed at, after all these years when I tell people that I get really nervous at the beginning of a tour they don't believe me. And I say but you don't understand, yes I'm singing a lot of comfortable hit songs from the past, but yes I'm also singing a whole load of songs that I've never sung before on stage. But these early days, the excitement was different because the Shadows and I were almost, well not almost we were in amongst the first group of people to ever sing rock and roll in Europe. Marty Wilde, Billy Fury, Dickie Pryde myself the Shadows and so we were breaking new ground all the time and it, that sort of excitement I guess will never come back.

DAVID FROST: And how different, differences are the, are the audiences these days, in a sense Tom Jones makes that joke on stage about they used to throw knickers onto the stage and now they throw their surgical corsets or whatever, but I mean are the audiences different?

CLIFF RICHARD: I suppose they are but I've grown up with a number of people, I don't know how much Tom's audience has changed over the years, I guess what's happened is the age range has changed, it used to be ten-year-olds and now it's my age, 60-year-olds, they've all grown up with me. I mean I seem to have gone full cycle now because there was a time when even my friends would say, you know I've bought your new record, you know I went into the HMV store and went, can I have the [whispers] Cliff Richard record please, just in case anyone was watching them buy one.

DAVID FROST: And at the same time you have this accolade which I suppose is a burden as well of being the Peter Pan of rock and roll, or the Peter Pan of pop, you've always said you've never had a nip and a tuck as some people have but, except you tried botox once or something?

CLIFF RICHARD: Botox...

DAVID FROST: Botox, that sounds better doesn't it.

CLIFF RICHARD: I did, my eyebrows dropped and I didn't like the, didn't like the look of it so, I don't think I'll bother with that again. But you know you get lines, I've got lines and things, I guess for men it's different though, I guess for women it's far more of a critical stage if they are getting wrinkly. But I mean I don't look too bad and so I, I can't be bothered with, I don't think...

DAVID FROST: Well you do look like Peter Pan and is it, do you think, since it's not nip and tuck is it, is it swimming, is it tennis, is it diet, you've been on a diet 35 years?

CLIFF RICHARD: Yeah well an eating regime more than a diet.

DAVID FROST: Yes.

CLIFF RICHARD: I mean I try not to eat more than one meal a day and I've stuck by that pretty, pretty religiously right the way through and I don't see myself as the Peter Pan of pop anymore, I keep saying the Rip Van Winkle of rock, but Peter Pan of pop was a great pleasure to hear people call me that originally, but once I hit 40, then 50 and now 60 it's really a bit of a pressure.

DAVID FROST: And in terms of fitness you were just talking about the diet, doing it religiously, and of course, I mean that's an obvious cue to the fact that you do a lot of things religiously since that turning point in your life when you found God which was when exactly?

CLIFF RICHARD: Well I don't know about exactly but in 1966 I did appear on the Billy Graham platform at Earls Court and I've been a Christian from about a year and a bit before, so 64ish, 65 maybe and I can't put my finger on an exact date but there was a period of time when I gave up in fact trying to tear it down, I spent quite, three or four years in a way trying to disprove it so that I could move on to the next one, to disprove Christianity.

DAVID FROST: And one Rabbi wrote a book in New York about why do bad things happen to good people or whatever and that area of suffering, the suffering of the good and so on is an area I've discussed with Billy Graham among others and it's an awkward area...

CLIFF RICHARD: Very...

DAVID FROST: I know you said, for instance, about the death of your friend Jill Dando, that you were angry with God at that particular moment...

CLIFF RICHARD: Yes.

DAVID FROST: It is very difficult to make sense of that?

CLIFF RICHARD: Very difficult but then you see it's got to be difficult, I mean if we could absolutely understand God, I've got a feeling we'd have got it all wrong, he wouldn't actually be the God that we're seeing here, he would be much less than that. If even science could prove him, I mean I find it interesting that fortunately I've got a number of scientists who are Christians too as well as being firm believers in science and who's not?

DAVID FROST: As the famous atheist quote, I'm an atheist Thank God, somebody once said on one occasion. But in terms, you've said for instance that you're, that you don't consider yourself celibate but obviously you've never married and so on, are you therefore in this beautiful house and so on, sometimes lonely?

CLIFF RICHARD: No I've never felt lonely, I have a lot of really, really good friends and over the years you, you cultivate that, I think, you, you don't, I suppose you do choose your friends to a certain extent but it seems to me that I've met people at the right time and I've built up a, a blockade of people that can, can support me in any kind of need that I might be going through. Well you know what it's like, you know the media itself can be so vicious, so helpful in so many ways and yet so vicious sometimes that then if I was on my own I'd have trouble. But I've always got someone I can phone up and talk to and ease myself out of that and it's no problem.

DAVID FROST: And so, and so are you going to just carry on, I guess you are really, carry on playing the old guitar until the day you drop...

CLIFF RICHARD: I think so...

DAVID FROST: And as you go on your way to the funeral, lift up the coffin lid and do a quick chorus of I'm Going On A Summer Holiday or whatever, but I mean are you going to carry right on to the end?

CLIFF RICHARD: I think so, what I'd like to do is slow down a little, what I'd like to do is pace myself to, if I did two things in one year, do only one of them that year and do the other one the following year so I would have more time to myself, for my friends and my family and to just enjoy, I mean I really, I have enjoyed myself - of course I have, but whatever happens, no matter how much you enjoy yourself it is still your work and I don't know that the every day man in the street would quite understand how pressurised our world is. So I can pull away a little bit and ease the tension generally I think I could enjoy myself now 'til, 'til the day I lift that coffin lid.

DAVID FROST: Well we thank you very much and we look forward to the 130th single.

CLIFF RICHARD: Thank you very much.

DAVID FROST: Thanks a million Cliff.

CLIFF RICHARD: Thank you David.

DAVID FROST: Cliff Richard.

Interviewer: Welcome to the Top of the Pops web chat Mr. Cliff Richard. The first question has come in from Fred Campbell. What do you think about the idea of a compilation album of all your duets with a few new duets with contemporary artists?

Cliff: I think it’s a brilliant idea and I’d never thought of that cos I have actually done a lot of duets with various people. I’m not quite sure how many we’ve got though, to fill an album but if they were going to collect it together with some other new duets then it would be rather good. My only problem with that whole duet thing is that is has been done a lot. Tom Jones did it, didn’t he, with a lot of new artists? I’d hate the idea that someone would say that ‘you’ve stolen Tom’s idea’. So maybe I won’t do that.

Interviewer: Was there a favourite one that you did with an artist that you look back on and think ‘Oh I’d love to do that again’?

Cliff: Oh I love Olivia. I mean she’s a really good friend of mine as well but she’s an under-rated singer. Most people said that ‘oh she’s got a tiny voice’ but most of us have! We’re not opera singers, but she’s got a perfect voice and she loves harmonies – as I do, so I gotta really warrant her. I think that the song I sang with her that I suppose was most successful was ‘Suddenly’ and I think that ‘Suddenly’ is one of the best pop songs ever.

Interviewer: Mmmm. With any of the coming tours, will any of the artists be joining you – any of the duet artists?

Cliff: No, when I go on tour, I tend to keep it to myself. I mean, it sounds really selfish but I haven’t been, for instance, on tour for about 10 years and I’m going to need to do a lot of the tracks on my ‘Wanted’ album. Obviously no-one’s heard me do any of them except on a television show and I will need to do a lot of the songs that people know me for – I’ve never thrown out the old hits. A lot of new bands I think make a big mistake in chucking out the old and replacing the oldies with the new but if you are doing a 2 hour show you can do the best of both. So I won’t have the time really, though it would be a lot easier for me if I only had to sing half the song – it would be great!

Interviewer: Ok! We’ve got a new question come in from Jane Halliday. She says; ‘With all your hits, which is your personal favourite?’

Cliff: I don’t know if I could choose just one of my songs. I’ve been given so many great ones to sing. I’d need –let me choose 3 or 4. Classic rock ’n’ roll song - ‘Move It’ – my first record ever – it still, it still sounds great, and I can play it on guitar or you can use electronics to play it with, it can be done with the band live. It’s a great, great pop/rock song. And then of course, there’s ‘Devil Woman’ I think ‘Devil Woman’ again, is much more contemporary than ‘Move It’ but I love songs that tell stories, have good hooks in the chorus line and if you’ve got a hook guitar – wonderful! And there’s 2 more. ‘We Don’t Talk Any More’ – the best song ever, ever!!! (Interviewer laughs) Not just cos I recorded it, I think, I often get asked to pick my favourite song of all time and I can’t pick that one cos they mean of someone else’s but I think that ‘We Don’t Talk Anymore’ is the best one - better than anybody else’s records ever. And anyone can sing it though. Really good songs can be sung by anybody. ‘We Don’t Talk Anymore’…..

Cliff: No I haven’t, no. If another pop singer had got hold of that they too would have had a big hit because it’s just a great song. And ‘Some People’….oh and ‘Miss You Nights’…oh there is too many!! (Interviewer laughs again).

Cliff: No I haven’t but I did hear a remix, and I’ve still got it at home, of ‘Miss You Nights’ believe it or not. A most unlikely choice. ‘Miss You Nights’ has no drums on the original version, it’s just an orchestral piece and because there were no drums I was following a conductor, it’s therefore slightly imperfect in terms of its tempo. You try to keep a tempo but humanly speaking, that’s not possible without (clicks his fingers to a beat). Somehow or other they managed to do a remix of ‘Miss You Nights’ in a very gentle manner but it’s got all the sort of electronics stuff on it and I really love it so watch this space cos I still think there’s a place to release a record like that, where you get a quality song dealt with electronically.

Interviewer: Hmmm. Okay, next question’s from Rene R who says; Do you feel that after so many records, you still have a lot to say musically and what’s your motivation for not chucking it all in and going to Barbados?

Cliff: (laughs) Well I think that anybody who can sing, and well I’ve been lucky haven’t I? I’ve had a long career, my voice hasn’t gone away yet and anybody who can sing can still offer something. It’s just very difficult to get it heard these days, I mean, I – it’s hard to compete if the goalposts are constantly being moved. So I have to now be satisfied with the fact that maybe my record sales are gonna be half what they used to be because radio airplay is pretty well zero – not everywhere – there are pockets of interest and regional BBC for instance, is very gentle and kind with me. But you know you need that massive airplay, you need that – your record has to be played 7 times a day, minimum 5, if you wanna have a big hit. So that you hear it in the morning and you think ‘oh he’s got a new record out!’, you hear it in the afternoon and you go ‘Umm not bad!’, you hear it in the evening and you go’ Cor I like that!’ and you hear it before you go to bed and then you think that you’ve gotta buy that! That’s how it always works. So, until you hear it all the time and then you say ‘I’m sick of it, enough already!’ (Interviewer laughs) But that’s okay as by the time you have a number 1, you can become sick of it but it is difficult now – it’s very, very difficult, but I still like to compete and so, umm, I did it once with ‘Millennium Prayer’ without any help from anybody other than the public, although I will say this: the media, who as you know, you’ve read things about people like me. It is really painful sometimes what they do to us but in the case of ‘Millennium Prayer’ the media, the written words, took up the hype on behalf of the ‘Millennium Prayer’ and myself and presented a story about my charity record which was being banned and the story line around it. The public heard about it without listening to the radio which was very strange. Then of course they then went into their stores and listened to it, liked it and bought it. It was the biggest selling single of that year – 1999/2000. I was really thrilled about that but I can’t find a story that the press will latch on to for every single I release. So I know it’s going to be tough but as long as I can go gold, my albums can go gold every time, I can make another album happily. If they don’t go gold, I won’t want to make another album cos I don’t wanna make albums that no-ones gonna listen to! What’s the point? I can go on tour!

Cliff: Gold is 100,000 sales. And it’s viable. If you can make a 100,000 sales then everyone makes money, the record company, me, writers. 200,000’s good, 300,000 – great and anything above that is a phenomenal bonus! I’ve met Gareth Gates and Daniel Beddingfield recently and when I said to Daniel that I’d had 14 number 1’s in my career he said ‘Is that all?’. (Interviewer chuckles) He thought I’d had hundreds of number 1’s. I was trying to say to him but it’s not the number 1’s that give you the career. It’s the 36 top 5’s and I don’t know how many top 10’s I’ve had, or how many top 20’s and every now and then a number 1 comes up and you go, YES! But the career is made up of the lesser ones really. The 129 releases are what’s important and the 128 top 30 hits – they’re the important ones. It’s interesting to me that the world has changed so much – Dan had said that his last record was number 1 and it wasn’t even a great song. He was really endearing and I like the way he said that. (Interviewer laughs again). Cos his record was terrific! He’s got more to come but I was trying to say to him if your next record is not number 1 – don’t be disappointed – it’s not a flop. If it’s in the top 10 – think ‘wonderful, I’m still there’ and aim at number 1 next time.

Interviewer: Okay we’ve got the next question here from Georgie Moony: What’s your next song about?

Cliff: Well my current single is called ‘Let Me Be The One’. I mean really it’s an in depth love song. I’ve got a feeling that it’s got a kinda Christian connotation cos it’s got the guy that wrote it writes gospel music – Chris Eaton. He wrote, you may remember my Christmas number 1 some years back called ‘Saviours Day’? He wrote that one. A record that should have been number one but wasn’t called ‘Little Town’, which was his new version of the old Carol ‘Little Town of Bethlehem’. It got to number 8 in the charts but I’d thought it might go to number 1 cos I think that’s my best Christmas record ever. But anyway he wrote ‘Saviours Day’, which was number 1, and he tends to write – he doesn’t have to mention God or Jesus or anything like that but he write about the feelings he has for God and when he wrote ‘Let Me Be The One’ I’ve got a feeling, though I must check it out with him really, it’s saying when you’re out on the ocean and you’re swimming against the tide, when the darkness surrounds you and there’s no way, you can’t see your way in on me – I believe he’s talking about God’s love but if you talk about God’s love, which is totally unconditional, and translate it into the love for a man for his wife - it’s a perfect translation because it means that you’ve understood perfect love and yours now translating it to another human being. I just think it’s a lovely song and I dunno what’s gonna happen to it – it may not make the top 10 at all this time. It doesn’t matter anymore to me as along as I know that I’ve made a great record and that I’ve made a record as good and I can make it. Do you know, may fans have always loved ‘Miss You Nights’ – all round the world? When I go to Australia I have to sing ‘Miss You Nights’. I can’t wait to get back to Oz because I discovered that in Australia ‘Miss You Nights’ was only in their charts for one week and the highest it reached was 130! And yet, it’s now their favourite song and they always ask that I sing it! So sometimes a record can slip by and still mean something so musically I feel that, yes, I still have a lot to offer. It may not be a number 1 record but then you know, they aren’t easy to come by!

Interviewer: We’ve got a question from Georgie talking of Pop Idol and meeting Gareth Gates: Which Pop Idol did you want to win?

Cliff: I must be the only person in England who didn’t see any of them. I was away from before Christmas and I didn’t get back until it was pretty much all over. I just saw that winning shot with the 2 of them standing there - that must have been worst than doing the Eurovision Song Contest! Anyway, one of them won but I did think that both of them could sing. To me it’s a song contest really and the contest was singers really but I suppose they were both good singers and the only other person I heard was, I think, was it Rick? He sang well too. And I’m sure they all sang well to get into that top 10 out of 1000 people – then you would have had to have been a pretty good singer. I like both their voices and I like both their records. I have a soft spot for ‘Unchained Melody’, it’s one of my favourite ballads of all time and now that’s probably the 2^nd time it’s been number 1. Cos I think after the film ‘Ghost’ came out, I think that The Righteous Brothers had a number 1 with it, haven’t they?

Cliff: Oh that’s right; they had it too didn’t they? So it’s great that he’s got hold of a really great song and again, I would say to Gareth, do not be disappointed if your next record does not get to number 1 – although it probably will – the heat of ‘now’, with everyone interest on Will and Gareth, it will probably be do quite well, but be prepared for a lesser hit – don’t consider it a failure.

Interviewer: Next question is from Megan Harper and it’s a related matter; who are your favourite singers at the moment who are in the charts or have been in the last 6 months?

Cliff: Well I’ve already mentioned Will and Daniel Beddingfield - I like them too – I like a lot of people I have to say but my favourite still go back because in a way the new singers haven’t proved anything to me yet. I know a load of people that can sing. I don’t know many people who can sing over and over and over again, who can change and manipulate their voices to make those different sounds over and over and over again and that’s what pop/rock is about. It’s not like opera where it’s a trapped art form. Opera has to be sung a specific way, you can never change the key - we change the key all time in pop/rock. We change the phrasing. Daniel doesn’t sing – not Daniel - Gareth doesn’t sing ‘Unchained Melody’ anything like the original. There is a certain amount of influence there, yeah, but he’s still got his own thing in, does his own little twists to it. So, to me, my favourite still – if I’m still down at home and wanting to play some good pop/rock music Michael Jackson is still fantastic, I love that one it seem to have masses and masses of hits on it. I love Bonnie Raite, I’m always surprised when certain people of a certain age have never heard of Bonnie Raite and they’ve never heard of Buzz Skaggs! Well look if there is anyone under the age of 30 watching me now and you’ve never heard of those 2 - you’ve got to change the radio station’s opinion of you! They decide that you won’t like those people so you don’t hear them. They are wonderful exponents of pop/rock music. Bonnie Raite is probably the best slide guitarist on the planet bar none. He does great vocals - does great blues and vocals. Buzz Skaggs again, well fabulous songs and great guitarist, you don’t know what your missing - I like those people very, very much and again they’ve done it over and over again. I’ve bought numerous albums and liked most of them. I don’t like everything all of the time but I do like most of it. So I would still say I play those over other people.

Interviewer: We had a question in earlier on, something about lack of airplay, you know how you raise stations and how you get them to play the stuff and the top one about the internet and whether you feel that – it a question from Alexander actually – why don’t your label use the internet much more as a form for releasing your music. I’ve seen so many web pages with so much inspiration and love dedicated to you and your music. Why not use this medium more instead of radio stations that don’t play your music in that sense?

Cliff: I think that is inevitable. I think that is what will happen but what you have to face is that the internet is not as big as they thought it would be at the moment. In terms of selling records when ‘Millennium Prayer’ came out, I thought that most – a lot of the sales would happen there, but they were minor compared to the actual 1.5 million or whatever it was that we sold, I think it was like in 1000’s only. So the internet I think is the future. I think that certainly it’s the future for people like myself, who struggle to get people to hear it, but it’s still un-chartered territory – so I think that we are slowly getting more and more into it.

Cliff: Sometimes I do, yeah and sometimes I pick up on MoveIt – the one about me and I check out what’s going on. I realised that everyone was really bothered about ‘Let Me Be The One’ because there was there was talk about there being some problem at source where they were being sold…

Cliff: I don’t think it’s….I think it’s been a little bit drawn out…I think there may have been a minor problem but if the record doesn’t sell, it doesn’t sell. Some people say that it’s a bad time to release a record because a lot of families are away for Easter but that would affect all records! I’m a big boy now, I can take it! If people aren’t buying my records then watch Des O Conner on Saturday, 9pm cos I sing it on that and the show…well Des is great to be with and it’s the kind of show I can shine on and I glow a little that night! But yes the internet is undoubtedly the future, it has to be, and they’d have to sort out how they pay people. How would you download a song and how do you pay for it? So it’s a major problem as if you start downloading songs and no-one paying for it that means that we don’t get paid and that means that we don’t make any records anymore!

Interviewer: I believe it may be on Top Of The Pops 2 as well or is the line up still to be confirmed?

Interviewer: So we’ll have to look out for that as well..okay, next question is from Ann. Are you looking forward to performing at Buckingham Palace in the summer?

Cliff: I like being asked by the Royals to do things – I’m a great monarchist. I keep hearing people who really make me angry when they’re anti-monarchists. They are such a great thing to have in the country. I travel a lot and most countries I go to, like America, they’d die for a royal family, they love our royal family more than we seem to. When I went to Russia for instance, they were so proud to show us all the palaces and things but they didn’t have any Kings or Queens alive to live in them. You just have that feeling that if someone were to come up and gone (must have done some action to the camera as speech went quiet!) – they’d have gone ‘Yyyeaaaaaaaaahhh!’!

They’ve invited a lot of artists to be there and I’m looking forward to that concert in the back garden. They’ve got some concepts for it as it won’t just be artists coming on and singing their biggest hits, as least I think it’s not gonna be like that. It was suggested that I would link between Elvis and myself because the Queen remembers the advent of rock ‘n’ roll, she saw all that come in and then myself come over as a British artist, so they are talking about me doing an Elvis song and then me doing one of my songs and perhaps singing with, I dunno, S-Club-7 or something and that really appeals to me. If they do that it will be a wonderful show and I look forward to that.

Cliff: Oh to sing there, I mean, a big stage behind the palace, it will be fantastic! Again, why are we talking about this because there is magic involved with it. When you think about it, all our history is based on Kings and Queens and Kingdoms and battles, good Kings and bad Kings and we’ve still got ours alive and our royal family is physically attached to history! We don’t have to go and look it up in Somerset House, or wherever it is, our own backgrounds are hard enough to find, we actually have a monarchy that is still alive and still using the palaces. So when you go in, these are for real! I think that’s wonderful. Why do we wanna get rid of it? I can’t understand it. I sometimes it’s a policy of ending…instead of looking forward to where we wanna go personally, we looking, saying ‘What’s he got? Oh he’s got more than I’ve got, oh she’s Queen, she gets paid this an…”. Forget it! Just enjoy it and do your own thing and dabble in everything. I think the monarchy should stay and I hope always it will.

Interviewer: Question from Paul. Who’s the most amazing person that you’ve ever met?

Cliff: Oh there are a couple of people and they’ve both got a religious side of things really. Mother Teresa. The reason I felt that she was so phenomenal was because it’s not that she just did good things, she gave her life to do good things. She stopped being an ordinary person, if I can use that phrase and went to live in Calcutta and helped people to die with dignity. She gave up life really, the life that you and I know. When I met her it was just phenomenal to talk to someone who could really look at and admire without feeling that there were any strings or any skeletons or anything like that.

Cliff: I met her in Calcutta, yeah. The other person was Billy Graham. I find it inspiring when people remain true to what they believe. If they are Buddhists and they remain true, then I have great admiration for them. But then if you have philosophy in your life you should you live it all the time. Dr Graham of course, I am bias towards as he happens to have a faith similar to mine and so obviously there is an added attraction. But nevertheless he still comes over as a man who’s been around, for what seems to me, what seems like forever and his integrity is still good.

Interviewer: A question from GM who wants to know if you ever won a Brit award and what for?

Cliff: I don’t think I’ve won a Brit award but whatever happened before that I’ve probably won the equivalent way back in history because when I first started singing in 1958, the first award I ever won was to do with the newspaper than ran it, the NME. They ran a poll ever year, the public would vote and I was awarded ‘Best Newcomer’. Then the following year and the following 10 or 12 after that, I won the ‘Best Male Vocal’ award every year. The things changed and I don’t know how long the Brits have been going but I don’t think that I have won a Brit, not, though I may have won a ‘Lifetime Achievement’, but I can’t remember!

Cliff: I’ve got a downstairs cloakroom, downstairs loo, and someone said: ‘Why do you keep them in the toilet?’ and I simply said that everyone goes to the toilet!! So they’ll all see my awards and go ‘Cor I didn’t know he’d won that!’. I’ve got a lot of award in there.

Cliff: No, my Knighthood medal is in my safe. You can’t wear it everywhere! Though perhaps I should wear it for Top Of The Pops 2 or something…but there are certain times you can wear it and other times when you can’t., so I keep it safe in my safe.

Interviewer: Got a question from Alma who is based in Australia who is asking a very personal question: Where did you spend Easter and was it relaxing?

Cliff: I had a fabulous Easter because I’d started working on promoting the new single – ‘Let Me Be The One’ – you mentioned earlier about using the internet didn’t you?! (Interviewer laughs). I had 5 days free and encompassed both sides of the Easter weekend, so it was terrific. I had some friends over to dinner on Good Friday, I had friends over for Tennis on the Monday and just lazed around really!

Cliff: My game is pretty static at the moment. You have to play almost every day if you can to see any marked improvement in your game of tennis. Anyone watching me who plays tennis knows that to be really true and I’ve been a bit erratic at the moment as recently I’ve not played a great deal. But it wasn’t bad!

Cliff: I do a charitable tennis tournament every Christmas at the Birmingham National Indoor Arena. Tickets will be on sale in July, or around July time, so watch this space as I’m sure they’ll have an announcement on the internet. Its great fun and we’ve changed the format a little now. We’re getting more professional players and making up two teams of really great players, I mean, wonderful players! The two captains are amateurs, me and somebody else. It’s just great fun! Comedians have always loved it because they can make fun of themselves and the other players and it’s a great entertainment evening for the public. We’ve been well supported now for almost 20 years – I’ve got a feeling that this year will be out 19^th year, so we’re coming up to out 20^th year.

Interviewer: Next question is from Richard Hampton who asks quite a simple question: what are your hopes for 2002?

Cliff: I guess my hopes are always the same – I hope I’m number 1, I hope I’m still alive, I hope my tour goes really well, I hope I get great reviews. We all have hopes like that. In general terms, in terms of what I’d like to do, obviously I will work really hard when it comes to rehearsals for my tour, I’m already working pretty hard on helping my single along but along side those hopes you have to have a realistic approach to things and say, well okay, if this doesn’t work the way I’d quite wanted it to work this year then my hope is that when I do it again next year I will have improved the situation a little. Maybe I’ll make an album next year that no-one will be able to resist! So my hopes are pretty general and I really hope that when I need the fans this year on tour that they’ll feel there has been some change in me personally, cos I feel there has been. In the way that I speak and in what I sing I’ll be able to express that.

Interviewer: Well I know that you’ve got to get off and get ready for your performance, so let me make the final question now. We’ve picked one up from Bev Hopton, who wants to know when the lights go up and you see your audience dancing and singing, how does it make you feel?

Cliff: I don’t think that there is any way I can explain what it’s like to face a live audience that’s entirely on your side. Every artist knows what it feels like but it’s hard to put it into words. You feel humbled; you feel ecstatic that people came out on a cold night when they could be watching Coronation Street and they’ve come to see you; there’s the excitement of knowing that they are going to love the music that you play – all of that. I always find that live concerts for me are the best things in show business. It’s a pleasure to make records but that’s almost the easiest thing I do. I can sing, I can go in there, stick my throat onto a microphone and sing songs and it’s great fun, I love doing that but live concerts are more challenging; to try and sound like the record that you’ve made; to reach out to people and make them that they’ve learnt a little more about you. Sometimes you go and see a concert and you’re sat watching an album, but it’s not quite as good! If you’re not actually told anything you don’t know anything more about the artist than when you came in. So I…I’ve forgotten you question now! (Interviewer reminds about when the lights come up..) The audience response, well you can gauge it pretty well from the word go, but it’s an amazing, phenomenal feeling. Because, although it’s not loving your Mum or your Dad or your husband or wife, it is based on love. Me for them and them for me. It’s an unusual kind of love because I don’t know any of them; well I know some of them cos I’ve seen a number of them in front rows of audiences throughout the years – the ones that come regularly, but nevertheless I always think it’s a very strange love affair that you have people that perhaps you will never really get the chance to get to know and yet, just for those moments you’re on stage, you can actually feel that you’ve touched each other. It’s a wonderful feeling.

Cliff: My pleasure. Thank you and thank all of YOU for logging on, I hope it hasn’t been too strenuous to keep up. They guy that’s been writing for me asked me to speak slowly, so it does me good anyway as I tend to speak to fast. So I’m learning from the internet how to communicate! That’s com-mun-ni-cate!

Brian Viner meets Sir Cliff Richard
'If I can get away with looking in my forties then that's perfect!'

He is 6I, looks 20 years younger, yet still frets about his weight, his looks and whether he can continue to top the charts. Over a plate of Jammie Dodgers and Jaffa Cakes, the eternal Young One reveals what drives him and why he hasn't eaten lunch for decades

So, out to lunch with Sir Cliff Richard. At least that's what is mooted, until the message comes back from Sir Cliff's people that Sir Cliff would rather not go out for lunch, on the grounds of his extreme fame and the consequent security headache.

So, in for lunch with Sir Cliff Richard. Except that when I arrive at his redbrick mansion near Weybridge in Surrey, Sir Cliff's people inform me that Sir Cliff hasn't eaten lunch for some decades now.

I am ushered through the entrance hall, and through the vast living room acres of deep blue carpet, terracotta chairs and sofas, and a baby grand piano bearing photographs of Sir Cliff with Jill Dando, Sir Cliff with Gloria Hunniford, and Sir Cliff with Jill Dando and Gloria Hunniford to the conservatory, where Bill Latham, Sir Cliff's long-time manager, greets me.

After a while Sir Cliff glides in, offers a firm but oddly clammy handshake and, with the slightly robotic graciousness of one used to receiving gifts, accepts my bottle of Sainsbury's Classic Selection Pouilly Fume. In what I hope is not a tone of disappointment, I ask why he doesn't eat lunch.

It all stems from an early episode of his beloved Coronation Street, he explains, 'When Minnie Caldwell said, I love that chubby Cliff Richard.' Stung by Minnie Caldwell's observation, he has since stuck to one meal a day, and rarely cooks for himself.

'But I can cook. I do a mean gravy, using a German gravy powder, which a friend of mine sends over, loads of onions, soy sauce, teriyaki sauce, Worcestershire sauce and red wine. And yesterday I did Brussels sprouts with chopped bacon and breadcrumbs.'

There seems something faintly surreal about talking to Sir Cliff about Brussel sprouts, but that's the thing about Sir Cliff: he is 61 now and has been famous since he was 18, so for 43 years he has been talking about himself to perfect strangers. Thus, he seems programmed, almost, to blether on any subject. If I asked him about crop circles, or red setters, or Plymouth Argyle, he would doubtless oblige me. I don't, although we do, over the next hour, cover his views on sex, wine, death, tennis, plastic surgery, Christianity, Chris Evans and George Michael, with just a Jaffa Cake (him) and a Jammie Dodger (me) to sustain us.

I ask whether he is still needled by the scorn heaped on his most recent numberone single, The Millennium Prayer? One of his prouder boasts, incidentally, is that he has had numberone hits in five separate decades.

'Yes, and top 10s in six. Establishing records is good. I've just created a new one at the Royal Albert Hall, by selling out on 32 consecutive nights. Someone will break that, so I'll go and do 38. It allows people to recognise that I'm seriously successful; serious in the sense that I work hard at it.'

This eagerness for acclaim, rather surprising after all these years, intensified during the I999 controversy over The Millennium Prayer, the Lord's Prayer set to the tune of Auld Lang Syne, which Virgin Radio's Chris Evans, for one, refused to play.

'Because he banned it, other radio stations played it all the time, so he'll never know how much good he did me. He's an unusual man. I know he's not dense. But he makes the mistake of believing he can go as far as he wants. He terrorised my records, and people got really upset on my behalf. He lost that battle hands down and things have never been the same for him since.'

And what about George Michael, who described the song as 'heinous'? It seems, I venture, a slightly overwrought adjective. 'Yes. I think he desperately wished he had the number one. I can understand him feeling jealous. I have, when another record has got to number one and I've thought, "Mine's better than that". But you learn to live with it. What I can't forgive is that he tore into another artist and a numberone record in such a vicious manner. I was once told to praise in public and criticise in private, and that's what I do. I idealise in public and pragmatism in private. George is a good writer and a good singer. He's made some great records. I don't understand why he felt the need. It was the most unprofessional thing I've witnessed in the whole of my 43year recording career. I didn't bother responding at the time. But now I can. Also, I did it on my own. I didn't have the help of radio the way he does.'

He delivers this rebuke evenly, neither his face nor his voice betraying any sign of anger. His face, while we're on the subject, really does belie his 6I years. I would guess that he's had some good orthodontistry, and I know he's had Botox injected into his forehead to iron out the wrinkles, yet his features remain more or less as nature ordained. And they do, up close, suggest a much younger man.

'I am grateful that my mother always looked young,' he says, when I mention this. 'My sisters and I have inherited that gene. I don't think I look 18, but if I can get away with looking in my 40s, that's perfect for my career. There's nothing wrong in desiring the past. I recently found a book of photographs from some of my old movies, Summer Holiday and The Young Ones, and I did look great. I always think I didn't sing that well. I tried too often to sound like Elvis and it was fake Elvis. I hadn't yet discovered Cliff Richard's voice. But I looked great, even though, at the time, I hated the way I looked.'

The Botox injections, he adds, weren't altogether successful. 'The furrows went but my eyebrows dropped. I'll only do it again if my eyebrows don't drop. But if everything starts hanging down I would not be averse to having surgery. I don't want to look 18, and I wouldn't give a toss what I look like at all if I wasn't always being photographed from all angles. But I am constantly competing against 18 year olds, so I don't want to look like a wrinkly, either.'

Which of his younger competitors, I wonder, does he particularly admire? 'I'm playing a lot of Atomic Kitten at the moment. Westlife and Steps have made some good commercial singles, but I don't necessarily play them all the time. I play Bonnie Raitt. And I play Michael Jackson's Thriller. He's by no stretch of the imagination my favourite singer. He's not even in my top 20. George Michael is, by the way, But it's a fantastic album.'

Sir Cliffs latest album, Wanted, features cover versions of hits made famous by others. A single from the album Somewhere Over the RainbowlWonderful World was released on December 3. Those are the facts. Subjectively, I have to admit that the album douses rather than lights my fire. But Sir Cliff's fans are said to be ecstatic. And in fairness' it is not for nothing that he remains the most successful artist in British pop history (source: Guinness Book of Records), beating his hero, Elvis Presley, into second place. I am eating Jammie Dodgers with a pop phenomenon.

He is, moreover, a pop phenomenon with a private life famously unblemished by drink, drug or sex revelations. Yet he loathes being called a goodytwoshoes. So I put it to him straight. When was the last time he committed one of the seven deadly sins? 'You only have to think it to be guilty of it. That's the perfection of Christianity. If you see somebody else's wife and desire her, then you are already guilty of adultery.' Has he, then, been guilty of adultery?

'Many times. It's impossible not to be guilty. It's called humanity. God knows we are not perfect, but by succumbing to His supremacy, He says, "I accept you". There is so little we have to do to be accepted by Him. That's what's so hopeful about the Christian faith. I am portrayed as some kind of plaster saint. As the Christian pop singer. But don't put me on that pedestal. I spend most of the time apologising to God for not being the person I would rather I was...'

However, the extent of his sinfulness is rather like the extent to which he is overweight. 'I need to lose six pounds,' he says. 'I'm carrying some fat, and I'm no longer comfortable in trousers with a 30inch waist. At the moment I'm a 31inch waist.' What a waist. And indeed, what a waste. So say many of his female fans, aware that, despite 'close' friendships with

Olivia NewtonJohn, Una Stubbs and Sue Barker, he has reportedly had sex only twice in his life. Does it infuriate him, this endless speculation about both his sexuality and his libido? 'Actually, I quite like the mystique of it,' he says. 'Besides, nothing I've said in 43 years has stopped the media asking the same question. I've had journalists asking me questions I don't ask my best friends. I wouldn't dream of asking my married friends how many times they've had sex, or did they have sex last night, or are they going to do it tonight? I've never been celibate in my head, ever. I'm not a monk.'

He firmly denies ever saying that he has had sex only twice, while cheerfully conceding that he has been drunk only twice, once after his record company offered to fill his car with anything he wanted to eat or drink. He chose smoked salmon sandwiches and Champagne. 'I was coming back from Leeds and when I got home I realised I wasn't well. In the end I moved my pillow into the bathroom, so that I could be sick four or five times that night. And I thought, "Some people do this every weekend." I'm not a prude about it, but I recognise my limit.'

Interestingly enough, he recently started up in the wine business himself, and next year aims to produce 35,000 bottles from his Portuguese estate. But what of his own extraordinary life? Given that he is 61 but looks 41, at what age, given the choice, would he like to take his mortal bow? 'I'm aiming for 125,' he says. 'And if, at 125, I can still play tennis, then I'll aim for 150.' I scrutinise his face for signs that he is joking, but find none. Perhaps it's the Botox.

Pop legend Sir Cliff Richard talks to Lee Jordan about his 43 years at the top and his fight to stay there

Bill Latham, Cliff Richard’s close friend, is concerned that the interview does not exceed its allotted time, and another PR man is at a table laying out sleeves of the new Cliff Richard album, Wanted, and the first single from it, Somewhere Over The Rainbow/What A Wonderful World, an innovative amalgamation of the two classic songs. He too is keeping an eye on the clock.

Saga Magazine has arrived 10 minutes early. We are waiting for the Peter Pan of Pop to make his grand entrance. And then… the artist with more UK record sales than the Beatles and Elvis walks in. There is no star swagger or celebrity aloofness about him. He is genuine, the real McCoy. There is no switch in persona for this knight, and whether he is facing an audience of one or thousands, Cliff Richard lives up to his “nice guy” image. He seems truly pleased to meet me and although he is adept at answering an interviewer’s questions, his enthusiasm and anticipation concerning his new musical venture mean that today Cliff is excited and happy to talk.

Our conversation is taking place in the conservatory of Cliff Richard’s magnificent Surrey mansion, complete with tennis court. Outside, the early autumn sky is fighting off a late resurgence of summer as the sun shines down on the glass roof, warming up the room and creating a relaxed ambience. He pours the tea. A lemon tree encircled by a table, so built to give the effect that it is growing through the centre, is suffering from a bug and is being treated, explains Sir Cliff. He is a keen gardener and also employs a professional to take care of his sprawling, lush green lawns and host of colourful plants. In the adjacent lounge, carpeted in a stunning, sapphire blue, is a grand piano decorated with photographs of happy times with family and friends. His mother (who suffers from Alzheimer’s disease) and three sisters are an integral part of his social life, as are pals such as Gloria Hunniford and Sir Elton John; he is still in regular contact with Hank Marvin, Bruce Welch and Brian Bennett from the Shadows’ days. He looks back to the years with his former band with fondness: “Do you know I was probably the first person to bring a Fender guitar into the country? I bought it for Hank. But there were reservations because it was pink. It was similar to the one Buddy Holly played but his was a Stratocaster.”

After a year’s sabbatical and his well-publicised 60th birthday celebrations when he hired the luxurious yacht Sea Goddess for a jaunt with friends – including Sue Barker and Olivia Newton-John, women he has been romantically linked with – on the French Riviera, Cliff Richard is looking fresh, invigorated and sickeningly healthy. “I take that as a fantastic compliment, I haven’t exercised for ages,” he says, shaking his head. And although he has not yet had cosmetic surgery he would consider it, but only because he is a performer in the public eye. The word retirement does not enter his vocabulary. Why should it? The new single – his 128th – is about to make him, perhaps, the first artist to have had a hit in six consecutive decades. So is another Christmas number one on its way?

“Who knows? You never aim that high, then you will not be disappointed if it doesn’t happen. And without airplay it is difficult to climb the charts. But I have dealt with that problem and accepted it.” He is referring to his last single, Millennium Prayer, which made the top spot in Christmas 1999 and, more poignantly, was the first British number one for the 21st century. But before the celebrations, rock and roll’s great survivor had a fight on his hands. For the first time in his career he found he was not on the Radio 1 and 2 play-lists. And the reason for their arrogant refusal… ageism. Peter Pan had come of age. The thing was, no-one had told Cliff Richard. So the scene was set. The Captain Hook character was the “ginger whiz” and TV’s man of the moment, Chris Evans. He started the ageist ball rolling on his Friday evening live show, TFI Friday, on which for no particular reason he turned the heat on and conducted an unnecessarily belligerent interview.

A lesser person might have buckled under the spotlight of the young in-crowd show, but not Sir Cliff. No-one was going to push him around, his steel had been forged at an early age. When his parents moved from India to England, in the days when he was Harry Roger Webb, he was bullied at school but fought back and has continued to do so in his career; so he was well prepared to make a stand again. Evans went on to air his views on his radio breakfast show and encouraged other DJs not to play Millennium Prayer. Cliff went on to achieve another massive number one hit.

“I am still not sure about Evans. His whole career was built on an aggressive pattern of ‘laddishness’ and a crass and crappy style of interviewing. He thought (Cliff assumes a rough accent) ‘I can go where I like, I can do anything I want.’ I understand not everyone likes my records, why should they? I pick and choose, too, but if I dislike someone’s music I do not dislike them personally.

“When Evans took up arms against me, I think he blew it for himself and he ended up looking like a stupid child. And the public, though liberated, does have its limit. There is a distance that they will come with you but only so far. It has happened to people before, and unless they are clever they shoot themselves in the foot and end up hobbling back to the hovel. It is no coincidence that Zoe Ball took half of his listeners away from him.”

So does he enjoy the fact that Chris Evans has fallen from fame’s slippery ladder? “In some respects he is on his way down. But he has been very clever in his business dealings and he is not down in terms of lifestyle. But I know that if I lost my career, materialistically I would not have to worry but I am sure he must miss the attention and the glory.”

Cliff Richard’s career has been a constant focus of scrutiny. Tabloid editors seem to think it is inconceivable to be a “bachelor boy” and celibate, especially if you are famous. And being an evangelical Christian in the pop industry also goes against the grain. “Funny that,” he says, “if people are safe within their own belief system, why fear others who do not share your views? I am quite happy to sit with anybody.”

Ever since he burst on to the music scene with Move It in 1958 his fans have taken his lead and have not stopped gyrating every time a song by their idol is played. And though he has always “moved” with the times, speculation about his lifestyle has always filled gossip columns.

At every new stage of his profession it seems someone is out to discredit him. Never more so than when he played Heathcliff. He was ridiculed for taking on the role, yet he successfully played to sold-out theatres around the country. So is it because he goes his own way that people try to trip him up?

“When I look back in terms of rock and roll and pop, I see myself as a kind of radical. I did not do what everyone else did. You can put the Stones, the Who and others in the same category – they rebelled, trashed hotel rooms and threw TV sets out of windows. I didn’t. It’s hard to be different. I mean, who was being radical? I say this with tongue in cheek but think about it. OK, so I drink but not a lot and I have never smoked or done drugs. And I can look any of my contemporaries in the eye and say my last record sold a million copies. They do not like to answer why their sales are not so good. It is a shame. The sex, drugs and rock and roll outlook is not broad enough, it’s blinkered. The irony is they believe they are liberated but really they are chained.”

Cliff is aware that Mick Jagger recently featured on the cover of Saga Magazine and sees it as a logical progression. “Saga is the butt of ageist jokes. But why? Mick is the right age. Thirteen years ago Tatler ran an article about grey power. At the time I had never heard the phrase. The statistics read: the smallest population of the Western world is below the age of 18. I had thought for years that all my records were aimed at kids. Suddenly we were beginning to realise that all the rockers of the Sixties had grown up – the power was now in the hands of the 30- to 60-year-olds. So I told EMI that they had to sell me differently… They chose not to listen.

“My point was proved when the hoo-ha surrounding the release of Millennium Prayer began. Saga is on to an absolute winner. Something like Saga Radio is aiming at people who love all kinds of music, from the classical to Elvis to whatever. If the magazine publishes a story on Mick Jagger it will appeal because all readers can relate to it. People like Pete Townshend of the Who will always be ‘cool’ (Cliff laughs and says that he was using the word in the Fifties, I point out that it is back in use, he gives a ‘Yes, I know’ kind of smile) to the people who remember them.”

He says he has survived because of his desire to stay at the top and his Christian faith, which has given him direction. When I suggest that the Who and songs like My Generation no longer echo the views of people who were young in the Sixties because maturity has now mellowed and perhaps enlightened them, Cliff Richard disagrees. “Oh, no. The generation that remember the Who will still relate to the lyrics. Songs become a part of people’s memories, it does not matter about the timescale. Due to the drug culture back then, a person may not have lived to be old and that is also relevant today.

“When I sing a song now I know that someone will remember the time they got engaged or were married, or had their first baby. I’ve seen people in the front row knowingly nudge each other as I start a song, it brings back a special moment.”

He is overwhelmed by the support of his fans. “Some give up their holidays to follow me on tour. And often before a show I will take a peek at the audience and see familiar smiling faces and reunions going on.” But you do wonder if the adoration ever gets him down and whether he fears obsessed or deranged fans, especially in the light of the murder of his close friend Jill Dando.

He explains that he feels secure where he lives and applies the philosophy of his faith to her death. “I believe that free will allows us to choose to do good or bad. The person that killed Jill carried out a despicable act, a bad, evil thing, and poor Jill was the victim of his anger. But she had a strong faith. I believe that Satan was smirking on that day. Jill was not perfect but I truly believe she is in a better place. With regards to my faith I cannot say why it happened to Jill but one day we will know.

“What I do know is that they have found a man guilty. Do you know, when the investigation started certain people looked through all her private books and diaries trying to find skeletons? They did not find a thing. I know this because I am good friends with her fiancé, Alan Farthing. Though the loss of Jill was tragic, for me it was another step of growth in life and a number of us grew. If something like that happens to me I would like to think that my friends would philosophise and say, ‘Through this we can grow’.”

He ponders other aspects of his beliefs. “A couple of years ago I would have said I was a pacifist but when I think of the New York terrorist tragedy and listen to those who oppose military action I wait for answers as to what we should do, but frustratingly they do not give a practical one. Governments and the good of all faiths should join in common union at this precarious time and work together and rid the world of terrorism.”

Away from the stage Cliff Richard enjoys reading vampire novels and he “loves” the film Bram Stoker’s Dracula. His ideal “summer holiday” is to escape to his farm in Portugal, “where privacy is assured”. He describes his favourite destination as a country with “Third World appeal but with all the mod cons”. As a tennis fanatic he heads the Cliff Richard Tennis Foundation. Its aim is to teach children from all backgrounds the game, and the pro/celebrity matches that raise money for the programme are hugely popular. Another charity that he dedicates himself to is Tearfund. “One afternoon I was recording at Wimbledon and the next day I was in a Ugandan village where 80 per cent of the locals were suffering from Aids. It certainly brings you down to earth,” he says.

But for now Cliff Richard is again preparing for an assault on the charts; he faces tough competition for the coveted Christmas number one single. But the artist who has claimed the top spot without airplay may have another trick up his sleeve. The new cover album contains special interpretations of some of Cliff’s favourite songs.

“I guarantee people will be singing my versions in years to come. Wait until they hear what I have done to Elvis’s All Shook Up.” It certainly has the sound of a man at peace who is enjoying himself. And as Somewhere Over The Rainbow/What A Wonderful World is released he will know that this time one of the opposition has fallen from grace and that ginger is not a colour of the rainbow.